Just talked to Brandon Williams & he told us he is staying at Arizona!

[Jdmarti]

What's this mean by the old pic of b.will driving the ball.

[Liquidated]

We get it dude, you don't like Williams for some reason. But what you fail to comprehend is you are the only one. We all love him. You are absolutely the only one that would prefer Hazzard or PJC to Williams at point. It makes me question rather you actually know what you're talking about or you just like to rile people up.

No Nico can't play 40 minutes. Injuries happen, fouls happen. the kid is a freshman. We need a competent and capable PG to back Nico up. Hazzard, DD, can not do it and no Smith can not freaking do it that's laughable. So yes losing really our only option at backup PG would be a season killer.

You love your damn statistics so much well here you go. Williams was averaging 13.8 points and 3.5 assists in Pac-12 play before his injury, upping his shooting percentages to .436/.400/.836.

That is the Williams we are expecting. That is why we think you're a fool when you say he has hit his peak. He was tearing up the beginning of PAC 12 play and he wasn't the same afterwards. He may never be the same but that doesn't mean he's talentless as you say,  but if we can get the Williams back before he was injured he is absolutely our best option at point when Nico is not in and that is without question.

You surround him with actual talent rather than the temp players we had last year and he will blossom.

And ya by the way if we don't have Nico the season would be over before it even began. You speak such nonsense.

Point guard is the most important position on the floor you see what happens when miller has good point guards IE: TJ. Then you see what happens when we have bad PG's basically every other season. Nico and Williams would be best tandem Miller has ever had and we need that rather you agree or not the rest of wildcat fans do.

I don't dislike Williams - why would you say that? He's just not a great BB player and not AZ good. I like Ira Lee, too, same deal. So you like the four star guy who led us to 8th place in the pac 12? That's cool. I'm just hoping for something better.

Williams is no more of a point guard than Smith or Doutrive or anyone else on last years team. He's just not. Another classic Miller combo guard - jack of all trades, master of none.

PJC had the gene was my point, Williams does not. I would prefer Hazzard just based on his stats, I have never seen him play and you will note that I wrote options solely about empirical data. Based on previous posts in this very thread, pretty sure there are some who would prefer Hazzard. Again I only prefer him because he hangs on to the ball better.

We've had several elite players play close to 40 minutes per game over the years.

If you surround Williams with talent, he will become the only 'temp' player. We had an entire team of them - he was not much better than anyone else. Randolph was on fire for a while..

The season IS over before it begins. IF, at the end of the year, we flame out - lose to lower seed early in the tourney or fail to make the tourney  - then how about you admit that Miller sucks and/or over hyped talent never lives up to expectations, especially under Miller.

So because I am not part of the groupthink - my opinion is not valid. It should be just the same as everyone else's? Your notion of consensus here does not reflect the ideas or attitudes of many people I know

[KansasCityCats]

Why is the Miller's level of success always hinged upon losing to a lower seed?

Coach K has lost more than 20 times to lower seeds in the tournament (including losses to #11 BC, #9 Eastern Michigan, #10 Providence, #11 VCU, #15 Lehigh, #14 Mercer and a couple 7-seeds).

To the point, Williams takes care of the ball.  Since his major injury in HS, he hasn't lived up to his "scoring" potential, but he will be an amazing backup PG/combo guard on a team that should have an opportunity to go deep into the tourney.

[wildcatinthewoods]

We get it dude, you don't like Williams for some reason. But what you fail to comprehend is you are the only one. We all love him. You are absolutely the only one that would prefer Hazzard or PJC to Williams at point. It makes me question rather you actually know what you're talking about or you just like to rile people up.

No Nico can't play 40 minutes. Injuries happen, fouls happen. the kid is a freshman. We need a competent and capable PG to back Nico up. Hazzard, DD, can not do it and no Smith can not freaking do it that's laughable. So yes losing really our only option at backup PG would be a season killer.

You love your damn statistics so much well here you go. Williams was averaging 13.8 points and 3.5 assists in Pac-12 play before his injury, upping his shooting percentages to .436/.400/.836.

That is the Williams we are expecting. That is why we think you're a fool when you say he has hit his peak. He was tearing up the beginning of PAC 12 play and he wasn't the same afterwards. He may never be the same but that doesn't mean he's talentless as you say,  but if we can get the Williams back before he was injured he is absolutely our best option at point when Nico is not in and that is without question.

You surround him with actual talent rather than the temp players we had last year and he will blossom.

And ya by the way if we don't have Nico the season would be over before it even began. You speak such nonsense.

Point guard is the most important position on the floor you see what happens when miller has good point guards IE: TJ. Then you see what happens when we have bad PG's basically every other season. Nico and Williams would be best tandem Miller has ever had and we need that rather you agree or not the rest of wildcat fans do.

I don't dislike Williams - why would you say that? He's just not a great BB player and not AZ good. I like Ira Lee, too, same deal. So you like the four star guy who led us to 8th place in the pac 12? That's cool. I'm just hoping for something better.

Williams is no more of a point guard than Smith or Doutrive or anyone else on last years team. He's just not. Another classic Miller combo guard - jack of all trades, master of none.

PJC had the gene was my point, Williams does not. I would prefer Hazzard just based on his stats, I have never seen him play and you will note that I wrote options solely about empirical data. Based on previous posts in this very thread, pretty sure there are some who would prefer Hazzard. Again I only prefer him because he hangs on to the ball better.

We've had several elite players play close to 40 minutes per game over the years.

If you surround Williams with talent, he will become the only 'temp' player. We had an entire team of them - he was not much better than anyone else. Randolph was on fire for a while..

The season IS over before it begins. IF, at the end of the year, we flame out - lose to lower seed early in the tourney or fail to make the tourney  - then how about you admit that Miller sucks and/or over hyped talent never lives up to expectations, especially under Miller.

So because I am not part of the groupthink - my opinion is not valid. It should be just the same as everyone else's? Your notion of consensus here does not reflect the ideas or attitudes of many people I know

Dude you're a crazy person. Williams started the season with a 40/0 assist to turnover ratio. He was forced to be a combo guard because of Coleman. He always looked better and more confident with the ball in his hand. And again his assist to turnover ratio was wonderful before his injury.

He is Arizona good. You just don't even give him a damn chance. Again no one on these chat boards agrees with you about williams. And PJ could have the gene all he wants he still wasn't as you say Arizona good. Williams is 10 times better.

[Liquidated]

Why is the Miller's level of success always hinged upon losing to a lower seed? Coach K has lost more than 20 times to lower seeds in the tournament (including losses to #11 BC, #9 Eastern Michigan, #10 Providence, #11 VCU, #15 Lehigh, #14 Mercer and a couple 7-seeds).

From the very first time Coach K lost to a lower seed and until the very last time he did....how many championships did he win? How many Final Fours? That is the point. Lute lost to lower seeds, but then he also over achieved.  I thinkMiller over achieved early - but not a single season since Williams left can be defined as 'over achievement'.

To the point, Williams takes care of the ball.  Since his major injury in HS, he hasn't lived up to his "scoring" potential, but he will be an amazing backup PG/combo guard on a team that should have an opportunity to go deep into the tourney.

So he got injured in HS and hasn't lived up to his scoring potential but he's the reason we can go deep into the tournament? Seriously? Williams is fine as back up, which I said earlier...but he's not Jason Terry off the bench on a national championship team. He's just not. 

And if it's 3-5 minutes per game that Mannion can't play...any guard with a decent handle can take those minutes...likely with the same results. 

[Liquidated]

DUKE
2013-2014 - Losses to Mercer in first round
2014-2015 - Beats Wisconsin to win national championship

ARIZONA
2015-2016 - Lost to 11 seed Wichita
2016-2017 - Lost to 11 seed Xavier
2017-2018 - Lost to 13 seed Buffalo
2018-2019 - Did not make the tournament

See the difference?

[KansasCityCats]

Lute was 62 years old when he won his ONLY championship.  Give Miller 12 more years & we'll see if he can match that mark...I bet he does (if he stays in Tucson).

Coach K was at Dook for 11 seasons before he won the first championship.  Miller is there now.  Again, it isn't typical for coaches under the age of 50 to win titles at the highest level.

Dook made it to the '94 national championship...then went 13-18 (missed tourney), 18-13 (first round exit) and 24-9 (2nd round exit).  Should Coach K have been fired for losing to a #10 seed Providence when they were the likely favorite to beat Arizona & make the Final Four in '97?  Nope.  Fans were patient...and it paid off.

[Liquidated]

Lute was 62 years old when he won his ONLY championship.  Give Miller 12 more years & we'll see if he can match that mark...I bet he does (if he stays in Tucson).

Coach K was at Dook for 11 seasons before he won the first championship.  Miller is there now.  Again, it isn't typical for coaches under the age of 50 to win titles at the highest level.

Dook made it to the '94 national championship...then went 13-18 (missed tourney), 18-13 (first round exit) and 24-9 (2nd round exit).  Should Coach K have been fired for losing to a #10 seed Providence when they were the likely favorite to beat Arizona & make the Final Four in '97?  Nope.  Fans were patient...and it paid off.

The age argument is a strong one that I made in defense of Miller several years ago. Absolutely right, he is just now entering an age window when most coaches go to their first final four (with very, very few exceptions). And if Miller was recruiting and retaining better (other than the elite recruits), if there had not been a landslide of corruption, ncaa violations, investigations...etc... and if Miller was a better, more flexible more innovative in game coach or had just shown any sign at all of evolving as a coach over an entire decade - then my arguments would be specious (and would not be being made by me).

Specific to the age argument: Arizona is not a school where we should hope to develop a BB coach. The coach hired should be ready to go at an elite level. We are (or were) a blue blood.

As and aside, consider this: Pastner is barley 41 and he's been a HC for 11 years. He might suck now, but he's literally got a 20 year head start on most coaches for a power five type job. Interesting.

[arxpert]

Why is the Miller's level of success always hinged upon losing to a lower seed?

Coach K has lost more than 20 times to lower seeds in the tournament (including losses to #11 BC, #9 Eastern Michigan, #10 Providence, #11 VCU, #15 Lehigh, #14 Mercer and a couple 7-seeds).

To the point, Williams takes care of the ball.  Since his major injury in HS, he hasn't lived up to his "scoring" potential, but he will be an amazing backup PG/combo guard on a team that should have an opportunity to go deep into the tourney.

Liquid suffers from a parasite that makes him think Arizona is a blue blood program when we are in fact a Powerhouse program. There is a difference. There are levels to this.

One or 2 baskets made (meaning 3 final 4s --- Uconn/Wisco/Wisco) and Liquid would consider Miller an Elite top 6 coach (behind his precious Coach K, Roy Williams, Bill Self, Tom Izzo, Coach Cal). Flash in the pan Final 4 runs don't count as consistent Liquid.

[KansasCityCats]

True.  '97 is the one year that Arizona shouldn't have done anything in the postseason.

Beat up the 3 basement schools in the Pac-10 as our only 3 conference road wins (ASSU/OSU/WSU) and didn't win convincingly in any of the 6 tourney games (lucky to get by Providence, Charleston, USA, etc.).

Glad Lute pulled off the miracle because Arizona would still be considered the one major "powerhouse" that couldn't seal the deal if it weren't for Miles Simon.