I'm predicting Caleb Love to have a BIG game against Texas Tech. Obviously he's not playing great as of late, but he's not as bad as people are making him out to be. Everything he does is amplified good or bad because of who he is. His attitude and effort have been great. his shot is gonna fall early and often at Texas Tech.
I really hope you're right. Love doesn't let missed shots affect his confidence, which is both good and bad.
He missed 6+ field goals in EVERY game this season, except one (missed 5 against Samford).
I'd be ecstatic if he became a distributor first because we're unstoppable when he's looking to pass first. It's an unrealistic request but NBA scouts really want to view him as a point guard, not an undersized shooter.
He plays with heart and loves our program so it's hard to hate the kid. It's just frustrating to watch an excessive amount of shots miss.
Go score 25 by getting to the bucket and drawing contact on Saturday, Caleb!
I wish caleb love would start out by taking it too the rim, before shooting the 3 pointers. In my opinion he shoots way too many of them, an he is a streaky 3 shooter, there is
Nodought we need him to be good, I just wish he would shoot less 3 pointers unless he was wide open.
Unfortunately for Caleb, when he drives to the rim and gets fouled, he doesn't get the whistle. Idk what he's supposed to do if he's getting punished for doing the right thing.
Quote from: Naterade on January 16, 2025, 09:19:47 PMI'm predicting Caleb Love to have a BIG game against Texas Tech. Obviously he's not playing great as of late, but he's not as bad as people are making him out to be. Everything he does is amplified good or bad because of who he is. His attitude and effort have been great. his shot is gonna fall early and often at Texas Tech.
Love is at his best when he is playing 3rd or 4th option. He can chuck as many shots as he wants in the first 5 minutes and make them all if he is lucky and it still won't change the fact he needs to get out of the way of Bradley, Henri and Carter Bryant. KJ Lewis figured this out a while ago.
Quote from: |ᴘ|ʀ|ʏ|ᴍ|ᴇ| on January 16, 2025, 11:43:24 PMUnfortunately for Caleb, when he drives to the rim and gets fouled, he doesn't get the whistle. Idk what he's supposed to do if he's getting punished for doing the right thing.
Yes, he is supposed to continue and say to the ref Thank You Sir May I Have Another Missed Call.
That is how it goes when you are not Elite. You need to "earn" the right to get to the line 8 to 10 times per game. Chucking 3's as a M.O. is not how to get refs to respect you.
Last game was an ugly performance for Caleb, specifically in the paint.
Typically, he does a good job of drawing contact but he doesn't attack nearly often enough.
Quote from: KansasCityCats on January 17, 2025, 05:32:55 AMLast game was an ugly performance for Caleb, specifically in the paint.
Typically, he does a good job of drawing contact but he doesn't attack nearly often enough.
Refs stopped the whole "James Harden/Luka" thing a while ago. Forcibly drawing contact is not going to land much profit. It is better to just take the best shot you can.
Absolutely. Although Love is historically good at making his buckets when he attacks the rim. The "and one" is just a bonus if he can draw contact. Regardless, anything seems to be more productive than throwing up errant threes.
Quote from: arxpert on January 17, 2025, 01:11:14 PMQuote from: KansasCityCats on January 17, 2025, 05:32:55 AMLast game was an ugly performance for Caleb, specifically in the paint.
Typically, he does a good job of drawing contact but he doesn't attack nearly often enough.
Refs stopped the whole "James Harden/Luka" thing a while ago. Forcibly drawing contact is not going to land much profit. It is better to just take the best shot you can.
Unless your John Tonje vs Arizona.
He's career 32% from 3, this year he's 31%. He's career 47% from 2, this year he's 51%. He's career 82% on FT, this year he's 85%. He's not a good 3 point shooter and worse this year than normal, but he's on pace to take more 3's than any other year of his college career. I much prefer him driving and scoring and getting to the line, he's much more effective and productive that way. I've said it before, the long ball sexy, but driving will make him rich. Not much is sexier than a thick wallet.
There has to be someone that has too him those same numbers.
yet it appears he doesn't care, or he's trying to shoot his way out of a slump
Quote from: Azfansincebirth on January 18, 2025, 06:17:13 AMThere has to be someone that has too him those same numbers.
yet it appears he doesn't care, or he's trying to shoot his way out of a slump
At 32% it's been a 4 1/2 year slump. If he's trying to "shoot his way out of it", it's time to stop. He's a very good player and we need him, but he's proven he's not a good 3 point shooter.
Hard to argue that
Quote from: CatInFL on January 17, 2025, 08:40:07 PMHe's career 32% from 3, this year he's 31%. He's career 47% from 2, this year he's 51%. He's career 82% on FT, this year he's 85%. He's not a good 3 point shooter and worse this year than normal, but he's on pace to take more 3's than any other year of his college career. I much prefer him driving and scoring and getting to the line, he's much more effective and productive that way. I've said it before, the long ball sexy, but driving will make him rich. Not much is sexier than a thick wallet.
The only reason Love is not better is because Tommy has no system. If Love played with an Elite Point Guard who could set him up in a catch and shoot or in a wide open spot, then all those 3pt looks would be better and higher %.
So in words that a layman can understand...
Give Caleb Love a CP3 or Steve Nash and see how Love flourishes. Tommy won't put Conrad in to do that job so this is what we get. Bradley is not that guy. Bradley and Love should not be playing basketball together. Simple as that.
Quote from: arxpert on January 18, 2025, 02:21:47 PMQuote from: CatInFL on January 17, 2025, 08:40:07 PMHe's career 32% from 3, this year he's 31%. He's career 47% from 2, this year he's 51%. He's career 82% on FT, this year he's 85%. He's not a good 3 point shooter and worse this year than normal, but he's on pace to take more 3's than any other year of his college career. I much prefer him driving and scoring and getting to the line, he's much more effective and productive that way. I've said it before, the long ball sexy, but driving will make him rich. Not much is sexier than a thick wallet.
The only reason Love is not better is because Tommy has no system. If Love played with an Elite Point Guard who could set him up in a catch and shoot or in a wide open spot, then all those 3pt looks would be better and higher %.
So in words that a layman can understand...
Give Caleb Love a CP3 or Steve Nash and see how Love flourishes. Tommy won't put Conrad in to do that job so this is what we get. Bradley is not that guy. Bradley and Love should not be playing basketball together. Simple as that.
Tommy is no master roster builder that's for sure. Frustrating
No. Players create their own plays in the NBA. Love is unbelievably talented but erratic. He could play pro ball but his shot just doesn't have enough consistency to attract scouts (although he's grab their attention if he were 6'5").
Quote from: arxpert on January 18, 2025, 02:21:47 PMQuote from: CatInFL on January 17, 2025, 08:40:07 PMHe's career 32% from 3, this year he's 31%. He's career 47% from 2, this year he's 51%. He's career 82% on FT, this year he's 85%. He's not a good 3 point shooter and worse this year than normal, but he's on pace to take more 3's than any other year of his college career. I much prefer him driving and scoring and getting to the line, he's much more effective and productive that way. I've said it before, the long ball sexy, but driving will make him rich. Not much is sexier than a thick wallet.
The only reason Love is not better is because Tommy has no system. If Love played with an Elite Point Guard who could set him up in a catch and shoot or in a wide open spot, then all those 3pt looks would be better and higher %.
So in words that a layman can understand...
Give Caleb Love a CP3 or Steve Nash and see how Love flourishes. Tommy won't put Conrad in to do that job so this is what we get. Bradley is not that guy. Bradley and Love should not be playing basketball together. Simple as that.
You may well be right, but then it was no better at UNC. Either way, a good player works within the system that they inhabit. In this system he is far more effective driving, scoring and getting to the line. Todays hack-a-thon was not a good example of that, but I thought this was one of Calebs better games. His defense was spot on, he didn't take bad three's until the end of the game when they were needed, he drove and got hammered frequently. He just didn't get the calls that he should have. He could easily have scored 12 from the line today.
Quote from: CatInFL on January 18, 2025, 09:22:19 PMHe could easily have scored 12 from the line today.
True, but he didn't. My response to all of that is simply - Caleb doesn't deserve the minutes.People throw the word "earn" around here a lot. Caleb hasn't earned minutes. He just got paid a fat paycheck. One that ran names like Sanon and Phillips out of town before the got here.I keep saying that the toothpaste can't be put back in the tube.The money is spent. Doesn't mean Tommy has to play the kid. He can be better off watching Conrad work PG with Bradley at SG at this rate
There really is a strange misconception about Caleb's ability as a player. While he can have a good game here or there, he's not a good player. The narrative this year is that he's in a slump but the reality is he's right at his career 3p% and FG%. In fact, of his 5 seasons in college, this year's 38% FG would be the second most efficient season of his career. And for those advocating that he get to the line more, he's never shown the ability to do that. He hasn't averaged more than 4 FT attempts a game in a season. And with the way the B12 calls games that number is not likely to rise.
What you're seeing now is what Caleb Love is. All you can hope for is that we get in the tourney and he goes on a heater for 2 or 3 games.
Tom's Mistake
- not developing Caleb Love into PG1 from Day 1
Sean's Mistake
- not developing Allonzo Trier into PG1 from Day 1
Both mistakes: not developing Kriisa into a PG on day one...
Quote from: arxpert on January 19, 2025, 09:56:25 PMQuote from: CatInFL on January 18, 2025, 09:22:19 PMHe could easily have scored 12 from the line today.
True, but he didn't. My response to all of that is simply - Caleb doesn't deserve the minutes.People throw the word "earn" around here a lot. Caleb hasn't earned minutes. He just got paid a fat paycheck. One that ran names like Sanon and Phillips out of town before the got here.I keep saying that the toothpaste can't be put back in the tube.The money is spent. Doesn't mean Tommy has to play the kid. He can be better off watching Conrad work PG with Bradley at SG at this rate
I generally agree, he has not earned the minutes. I would put it a bit differently though. I would say that we can't afford him as a 3 point shooter. Every thing else he does well, but he (and others) have killed so many rallies this year with missed 3 pointers. When he makes a 3 pointer I get scared, because he instantly falls in love with the 3 and mmisses the next several.
Quote from: Paper_Bag on January 19, 2025, 11:25:24 PMThere really is a strange misconception about Caleb's ability as a player. While he can have a good game here or there, he's not a good player. The narrative this year is that he's in a slump but the reality is he's right at his career 3p% and FG%. In fact, of his 5 seasons in college, this year's 38% FG would be the second most efficient season of his career. And for those advocating that he get to the line more, he's never shown the ability to do that. He hasn't averaged more than 4 FT attempts a game in a season. And with the way the B12 calls games that number is not likely to rise.
What you're seeing now is what Caleb Love is. All you can hope for is that we get in the tourney and he goes on a heater for 2 or 3 games.
I think it's important to realize that his 38% FG is heavily weighted by his 3 pt attempts. He's 50% inside the line and 30 outside. It's also important to note that he's on pace to shoot more 3's this year than any other year of his college career. I believe that if he drives more, he'll get fouled more and shoot more FTs. It's simple fact that more fouls happen closer to the basket.
Lloyd is sticking by Caleb until the end per his last press conference after the loss to TT. He also said we played a close game although we were playing from behind the entire game. Lloyd is slipping back into his golly beav everything will be ok mantra. Will we be ok ?? I'm not sure we will this team still has not proved it can get past the 1st or 2nd round in the tourney if we even make the field of 64.
Quote from: |ᴘ|ʀ|ʏ|ᴍ|ᴇ| on January 20, 2025, 02:21:05 AMnot developing Allonzo Trier into PG1 from Day 1
Both aren't PG's. Miller could have tried to shove a square peg into a round hole all he wanted to, but he was always a SG and a good one at that. The Trier core had major issues that had nothing to do with the talent of the team. Whether it was Book/Rawle, Osterine, or the fake FBI scandal.. That core was a great core and never got it's fair shake.
Quote from: CatInFL on January 20, 2025, 10:51:29 AMQuote from: arxpert on January 19, 2025, 09:56:25 PMQuote from: CatInFL on January 18, 2025, 09:22:19 PMHe could easily have scored 12 from the line today.
True, but he didn't. My response to all of that is simply - Caleb doesn't deserve the minutes.People throw the word "earn" around here a lot. Caleb hasn't earned minutes. He just got paid a fat paycheck. One that ran names like Sanon and Phillips out of town before the got here.I keep saying that the toothpaste can't be put back in the tube.The money is spent. Doesn't mean Tommy has to play the kid. He can be better off watching Conrad work PG with Bradley at SG at this rate
I generally agree, he has not earned the minutes. I would put it a bit differently though. I would say that we can't afford him as a 3 point shooter. Every thing else he does well, but he (and others) have killed so many rallies this year with missed 3 pointers. When he makes a 3 pointer I get scared, because he instantly falls in love with the 3 and mmisses the next several.
Caleb is what Caleb is. He is a deep chucker. Not unlike Arenas aka Hibachi. The fact is Love was brought here to be a team leader. Tommy uses the portal incorrectly.
He recruits players and refuses to develop them. Refuses to let them play. Then they almost all transfer out. Some never to be heard from again, other flourishing.
Tommy shouldn't be recruiting our Team Leaders from the Portal. They are in the Portal for a reason. 99.9% of the time it is due to not being that good or just wanting to be paid or both.
If they are great players, they generally get a "raise" in the NIL era and stay where they are.
So Tommy is basically swinging and missing in the Portal on the best players. Then he is ignoring who he actually recruits that has real talent, and he is ending up having to start Mid Major players in heavy minutes.
All of which adds up to this overwhelming truth that we have a team that is 40% Mid Major starters and poor quality transfers from Power "4" conferences. Sorry to say. Awaka is not all that. He is just a guy who had a bright future and who is not being coached up to his potential.
And finally - Caleb Love could just go on a run in March Madness, but right now we aren't really a March Madness level team. We have to "earn" our spot in the dance. That is not "on brand" for Arizona Basketball to have to say.
This is not a weird transitional year where we had scandals or lost all of our recruits for bad reasons.
We lost recruits because Tommy is not a team builder. He used his resources incorrectly.
I am hoping that Bryce James is the catalyst of change. Tommy knows he can't do it alone. He needed someone with "star power" at least by Name to come in and help. I am shocked he got James. It is a huge deal.
Quote from: lynxaz on January 20, 2025, 11:01:45 AMLloyd is sticking by Caleb until the end per his last press conference after the loss to TT. He also said we played a close game although we were playing from behind the entire game. Lloyd is slipping back into his golly beav everything will be ok mantra. Will we be ok ?? I'm not sure we will this team still has not proved it can get past the 1st or 2nd round in the tourney if we even make the field of 64.
This team is not currently a team I would put into the field of 68. I think Tommy has lost control and is just letting it all go at this point.
Quote from: arxpert on January 20, 2025, 02:35:41 PMQuote from: |ᴘ|ʀ|ʏ|ᴍ|ᴇ| on January 20, 2025, 02:21:05 AMnot developing Allonzo Trier into PG1 from Day 1
Both aren't PG's. Miller could have tried to shove a square peg into a round hole all he wanted to, but he was always a SG and a good one at that. The Trier core had major issues that had nothing to do with the talent of the team. Whether it was Book/Rawle, Osterine, or the fake FBI scandal.. That core was a great core and never got it's fair shake.
They could have been PGs is the point. If you've got the best handles and best 1v1 ability on your team, you automatically qualify as an option. Would most fans have complained if Love was PG1 instead of Kerr? Based on years of Kerr criticism, I doubt it. Would most fans have complained if Trier got PG duties behind Kadeem and then became PG1 instead of PJC? Based on years of PJC criticism, I doubt it. It's simply a "what if" that I believe would have been worth the effort.
Quote from: |ᴘ|ʀ|ʏ|ᴍ|ᴇ| on January 20, 2025, 04:59:12 PMQuote from: arxpert on January 20, 2025, 02:35:41 PMQuote from: |ᴘ|ʀ|ʏ|ᴍ|ᴇ| on January 20, 2025, 02:21:05 AMnot developing Allonzo Trier into PG1 from Day 1
Both aren't PG's. Miller could have tried to shove a square peg into a round hole all he wanted to, but he was always a SG and a good one at that. The Trier core had major issues that had nothing to do with the talent of the team. Whether it was Book/Rawle, Osterine, or the fake FBI scandal.. That core was a great core and never got it's fair shake.
They could have been PGs is the point. If you've got the best handles and best 1v1 ability on your team, you automatically qualify as an option. Would most fans have complained if Love was PG1 instead of Kerr? Based on years of Kerr criticism, I doubt it. Would most fans have complained if Trier got PG duties behind Kadeem and then became PG1 instead of PJC? Based on years of PJC criticism, I doubt it. It's simply a "what if" that I believe would have been worth the effort.
Miller never got a chance to coach the best iteration of the Trier team. It was marred by scandal and Osterine. Miller helped his guys get their chances though.
Miller also had to battle to get Kerr to America. Some people forgot about that. No time to work with him.
Lloyd certainly did no favors for Kerr.
Barcello was an elite PG Option that slipped through in a numbers game and a campus girlfriend situation.
In the end, right now is what matters and Lloyd had 2 "PGs" ready for this year and they abandoned ship because of his poor roster building.
Quote from: arxpert on January 21, 2025, 03:13:28 AMIn the end, right now is what matters and Lloyd had 2 "PGs" ready for this year and they abandoned ship because of his poor roster building.
That's laughable. Arizona has three guards ranked in the Big-12's Top-25 in Assists. All three average less than 2 TO/game, despite playing high minutes.
Quote from: CatInFL on January 20, 2025, 11:01:15 AMQuote from: Paper_Bag on January 19, 2025, 11:25:24 PMThere really is a strange misconception about Caleb's ability as a player. While he can have a good game here or there, he's not a good player. The narrative this year is that he's in a slump but the reality is he's right at his career 3p% and FG%. In fact, of his 5 seasons in college, this year's 38% FG would be the second most efficient season of his career. And for those advocating that he get to the line more, he's never shown the ability to do that. He hasn't averaged more than 4 FT attempts a game in a season. And with the way the B12 calls games that number is not likely to rise.
What you're seeing now is what Caleb Love is. All you can hope for is that we get in the tourney and he goes on a heater for 2 or 3 games.
I think it's important to realize that his 38% FG is heavily weighted by his 3 pt attempts. He's 50% inside the line and 30 outside. It's also important to note that he's on pace to shoot more 3's this year than any other year of his college career. I believe that if he drives more, he'll get fouled more and shoot more FTs. It's simple fact that more fouls happen closer to the basket.
I see your point and I also would rather he take shots within the three point line but I don't want to see him driving recklessly to the rim hoping for a foul. Love attempts more threes per game than twos because he isn't adept at getting to the rim or finishing through contact in the half court. My point really is that he's been in college, playing a significant role for 4 1/2 seasons. He is not going to become something he never has been in this final half season of his career. Last year he shot 41% from the field. I just want him to get to that number and hope he can carry us through a couple tough games.
Quote from: KansasCityCats on January 21, 2025, 08:45:54 AMQuote from: arxpert on January 21, 2025, 03:13:28 AMIn the end, right now is what matters and Lloyd had 2 "PGs" ready for this year and they abandoned ship because of his poor roster building.
That's laughable. Arizona has three guards ranked in the Big-12's Top-25 in Assists. All three average less than 2 TO/game, despite playing high minutes.
Your numbers always lack context and reality. We are not evaluating this mathematically. The game has to be played by humans on the court. This is where Numbers Do Lie. We don't need 3 guys with 4 assists per game if that is what you are trying to say. 1 guy with 12 Ast per game is far more powerful than 3 guys with 12ast per game. It is allowing everyone else to play a much more impactful role in different ways that matters more.
I respectfully disagree. Nothing should hinge upon the performance of one player, for countless reasons.
Having a team that truly shares the ball is indicative of a team that buys into their staff's game plan.
(And don't assume that I wouldn't want another TJ around because I'd kill for a true PG with a killer instinct; I just don't find it to be the most effective style of collegiate play).